DINOSAUR DISCUSSION 10

Game 2: Find the dirt!

Where did the dinosaurs come from?
Were they part of the creation?
Were they bred by the antediluvians?

Audience: Young Earth Christians

OK let’s have some fun and see if we can find some dirt. Now where to start? Let’s try the very top of the Cretaceous, that’s bound to be a lot of fun.

And we can look for some dinosaurs roughly from those rock layers.

First let’s look at the full structure...

Now though some people don’t believe the whole structure is real or can be found, evolutionists have answered this:

“the entire geologic column is found in 25 other basins around the world, piled up in proper order.”
Conclusion point 7
The Geologic Column
and its Implications for the Flood
https://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/geocolumn/

So we can be confident that all around the world these layers or a reasonable representation of them can be found.

So with that thought let us now wander down to the very top of the Cretaceous layers and have a look around...

So here we are at the very top of the Cretaceous and now we have a look around and what can we see? Well some of these may be distributed in various regions but we can imagine some of the following which have been found in upper Cretaceous rock layers...

Ankylosaurs, tyrannosaurs, triceratops, hadrosaurs, and sauropods. This is a simplified group but it will do.

So looking around we may see something like the following...

OK so here we are at the very top of the Cretaceous just a tiddly bit below the 66 Ma K-Pg Extinction point. So all around the world we have Cretaceous layers below our feet. All around the world.

And we are told that

“the entire geologic column is found in 25 other basins around the world, piled up in proper order.”

So have another look at our cut-down version of the geologic column showing nothing above the Cretaceous.

And these rock layers are currently what the paleontologists agree on. This layer of Cretaceous rocks all around the world.

What we are standing on and looking at all the fascinating dinos with nothing above.

Nothing above?

What should be above? According to our time, if Deep Time is correct.

Well since the Cretaceous we now have a lot of extra rock layers that have supposedly been deposited.

The Cenozoic rock layers. A lot of them, bringing us supposedly up to our day.

And just where did all the sediment and stuff come from to form these layers?

That’s easy someone will say, a lot of erosion and sedimentation, compaction and so on over millions of years and that’s how we got them.

Really? We were just standing on top of the Cretaceous and looking at a lot of dinosaurs. That’s all there was then. All around the world. And if the Cretaceous layers are still with us, then they weren’t eroded at all.

And just suppose the Cretaceous layers were eroded to form the next layers of the Paleogene then why do we still find Cretaceous layers?

Similar for the Paleogene, eroding to make way for the Neogene. Yeah we can keep playing this game like leap frog.

So should we be finding all these dinosaur fossils if the rock layers containing them should have eroded away to give new layers?

And just how much rock are we looking at? In fact let’s take that back to the eroded material, basically dirt before it is compacted and compressed to eventually form new layers.

For the Cretaceous, the W. H. Hunt Trust Estate Larson #1 drilled well encountered the top of the Cretaceous at approximately 4910 feet.

And approximately 5000 feet translates to approximately 1500 metres.

And though the depth of Cretaceous rock layers would vary around the world this still should be a reasonable approximation we could use to try some calculations.

Sand to sandstone suggests about 80% compaction. A very rough approximation. But we’ll use it.
In Discussion 11: we obtain a better approximation.

Using depth to Cretaceous at about 1500 m we require about 1500/80% or 1875 m of dirt to compact to about 1500 m of solid rock.

OK now let’s try to convert all this to cubic km.

1.875 km depth and land mass surface area approx 150x10^6 km2

gives approx

1.875 x 150x10^6 = 2.8125x10^8 km^3
See Postscript for corrected value.

of dirt required to form the missing layers.

That’s a lot of dirt!

But we can do better!

There is no reason this approach could not be used to go down to the lowest layer the drill encountered:

Precambrian at approx 14,945 feet and would require about 18,681 feet of dirt.

This translates to approx 5,694 m of dirt. Or 5.694 km.

This is our deltar value and we would obtain

5.694 x 150x10^6 km2 or approx 8.54x10^8 cubic km.
See calculations below for this surface area value.
See Postscript for corrected value.

That’s still a respectable amount of dirt required for our missing layers.

Just out of curiosity we could compare this with the volume of the Moon:

Moon volume: 2.1958 * 10^10 cu.km. or 21.958x10^9

And we obtain [8.54x10^8] / [2.1958 x 10^10] x 100% or approx 3.9 or 4% of the volume of the Moon.

Doesn’t sound like too much but that still is quite a lot of dirt missing!!

5.4% of the volume of the Moon of dirt to build the layers from the Precambrian up!

And again the big question is just where did all this dirt come from? Not from lower eroded layers [which would then not exist!]

Simple conclusions as before. These rock layers are not the result of Deep Time. Deep Time does not solve this problem.

These rock layers were not laid down as the result of straight sedimentation etc.

They came into existence some other way.

When this world came into existence [or at some later time, like the Flood etc] the rock layers were formed. As a complete fabrication, or a refabrication of the existing underlying rock structure from the Creation. Or some strange mix of fabrication and sedimentation with a lot of stuff reworked.
See Discussion 8 for more info about this.

And since a lot of this is a straight fabrication, that includes any rock readings contained in the layers themselves.

There is little reason to believe in Deep Time. This world may only be about 6,000 years old.

Repercussions for the dinosaurs

It looks like even with Deep Time the dinosaurs still don’t make it.

Since these rock layers came about some other way, they must be a fabrication or some form of curious mixture. If so the dinosaurs in the Mesozoic are in question. All of them. Apparently they never existed as living breathing creatures at any time in the past. They just came into existence when these rock layers did. Fully constructed as fossils in the rock layers and not fossil remains at all, but something else.

Some calculations

Density calculations
River sand 1500-1540 Kg / m3
https://dreamcivil.com/density-of-sand/#g_Density_of_River_Sand

Sandstone (hard) 2140 – 2650 Kg / m3
https://matmake.com/properties/density-of-rocks.html

Convert to metres!
Sand 11.45 units / m?
Sandstone 13.84 units / m? so approx 82.7% compaction occurring?

Moon volume
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon

Earth surface area.
Land is approx 30% of the surface area.

An interesting value: Land: 148,940,000 km2 or approx 148.9x10^6 km2.
Mean radius 6371 km.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth

Sphere approximation may be safer?
Surface Area x deltar: 4.Pi.r^2.deltar
4.Pi.r^2 gives approx 4.Pi.6371^2 or 4.Pi.6.371^2 * 10^6 or 510.07 x 10^6 km2
Then 30% gives approx 153.02 x 10^6 km2
Both approx 150x10^6 km2.

Postscript

The compaction approach used here is not correct and is done correctly in Discussion 11.
There I obtained a value of about 58%. Corrections follow…

Cretaceous
Using depth to Cretaceous at about 1500 m we require about 1500/58% or 2586 m of dirt to compact to about 1500 m of solid rock.

OK now let’s try to convert all this to cubic km.

2.586 km depth and land mass surface area approx 150x10^6 km2

gives approx

2.586 x 150x10^6 = 3.879x10^8 km^3

Precambrian
Precambrian at approx 14,945 feet and would require about 25,767 feet of dirt.

This translates to approx 7,853 m of dirt. Or 7.853 km.

This is our deltar value and we would obtain

7.853 x 150x10^6 km2 or approx 1.178x10^9 cubic km.

Moon percentage?

We obtain [1.178x10^9] / [2.1958 x 10^10] x 100% or approx 5.4% of the volume of the Moon.

Note: this is just over 1 twentieth of the volume of the Moon!!

REFERENCES

Companion pages

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